"You're being selfish... Complaining about your past... All I hear is 'me, me, me'"
"Paul said to forget what lies behind and press on toward the goal."
"Don't let your past define you."
"Get over your 'victim mentality' and get on with your life."
"Writing about such things breeds malcontent, bitterness, and unforgiveness."
"You must not be healed completely if you keep going back to these things."
Sound familiar? What I want to know is this: Who says that those of us who write against spiritual abuse, using our own pasts, aren’t moving on? Do they think that writing about what happened, about our own stories, means that we’re still stuck in that place? -That we cannot “get past it?” Why does it have to be either/or?
I don’t believe it does. These people like to quote Philippians 3:13: “But this one thing I do, forgetting those things that lie behind, and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.” They claim that we are not doing this. They claim that by not forgetting, we are not pressing on. But I say that we are. Do you realize that previous to saying this, Paul spent an entire chapter talking about where he came from? Talking about his past? He obviously didn’t forget. –He didn’t deny who he was, what he’d done, and where he came from.
Are we supposed to do this as believers? Forget where we were before Christ saved us? The New Testament is full of such phrases as “You once were ___. But now you are ___.” The writers of the epistles constantly speak of what things were like in their past and the past of their readers, while pointing to their present. Why? Because who we are is, in part, defined by who we were.
Think about it…
How can you write about healing without first talking about brokenness?
How can you proclaim victory without first speaking of defeat?
How can you claim freedom without first describing bondage?
How can I “comfort those who are in trouble with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God” if I cannot speak of how God has comforted me?
How can I speak of salvation without talking about what I was saved from?
How I praise God for His forgiveness if I cannot remember for what I was forgiven?
I cannot. It just doesn’t work that way.
I can speak of my past sins with sorrow, but as one who is not bound by them anymore. I can speak of past pain as one who has been and is being healed. Without the perspective of the past, we cannot understand our present or our future. This isn’t bitterness, though it definitely could be there. No matter who we are, we must constantly be watchful that we don’t let such things as bitterness and resentment take up residence in our hearts. That doesn’t mean we live in constant fear of being bitter. But there is a huge difference between remembering where I came from so as to not go there again, and dwelling on the sins of others in such a way that we let hatred of them consume us. Those of us who use our pasts to speak against a vile wrong, are not “breeding malcontent or unforgiveness.” Anyone who says different obviously hasn’t been reading the articles and letters on this site with openness.
And yes, I will always be a “victim.” As my friend, Lore, once wrote, “…A victim is a person who has been wronged, a person against whom a crime has been committed. The word has nothing to do with being strong or weak, or having a good or bad attitude. If someone was hit by a car, even if it was an accident on the part of the well-intended driver, that person is a victim of an auto accident. If someone’s house is robbed, even if that person took every possible security measure before, during, and after the robbery, and even if that person has a very proactive response to the situation, that person is a victim of a robbery. Likewise, if someone was subjected to a system of spiritual abuse, especially if that person’s parents imposed said system when the person was a child, that person has been wronged. To borrow from the Lord’s Prayer, that person has been ‘trespassed against.'”
I am the victim of a house fire. I always will be. Because it happened to me. This helps to explain a little about my heart, who I am, how I react to crises in my life, and why I hyperventilate when I see huge fires or freak out when I think I smell smoke in the middle of the night. When others find out, they have a better understanding of me. Remembering the fire doesn’t mean I’m still “stuck” back there in the past. It doesn’t mean that I haven’t moved on. Obviously I have. I’ve slowly collected new clothes, kitchen utensils, and furniture. The pain of losing all of my belongings does still cause my heart to twinge every so often, but that’s because pain doesn’t go away overnight. Healing is a process. I will never forget that memory. But its effect on me will change as the years go by.
We’re all on a journey. None of us get there overnight. We may even have set-backs from time to time. Some days we go miles. Other days… mere inches. But if we ever forget where we came from, we will be just as lost as if we do not know where we are going. Without the perspective of our past paths, out future paths aren’t as easily understood. We talk about our journey so that others might be encouraged on theirs. We tell them “I’ve been there. You’re not too far now!” and they get the courage to keep moving on. We say, “You don’t want to go down that path… I did just that and let me tell you where I ended up.” And some person might be saved from that mistake. We overcome by the blood of the Lamb and the word of our testimony. And it is by the word of our testimony that others, too, might be saved.
One last thought: Someone recently pointed out that if their daughter were to write about them the way I write about my parents, that they would feel horrible. I certainly hope you would! You should feel horrible when you have hurt someone you love. And then you should move on. Confess your sins to them and seek forgiveness. Pray for reconciliation. Be real and open and honest about your mistakes. And let grace have its way with you. But do not be offended if they then learn from your mistakes. Take them and use them to help others light their paths. Hopefully you too will be able to say, “Yes, I did that. I said that. I believed that. I taught that. I was wrong,” and let the shame roll off your back and into the gutter where it belongs.
Darcy, that was a great response! My house was destroyed by a fire, too, when I was a teenager. (It was our first week in ATIA, actually.) I completely relate to your analogy of being constantly aware due to circumstances of the past. God is good to push through those painful situations with us and give us the wherewithall to learn from past mistakes and such. You can't bury it in silence. You gotta learn from it!!! =)
Well said. !!
i agree as well!!! a rape or physical abuse survivor doesnt forget, how can they??? we can move on, but with different experiences than most and it colors who you are.
I agree with the article, and with the goal of this website. But just for clarification, a "victim mentality" is not healthy nor edifying. Someone who has a victim mentality is someone who has maybe been a victim, but who has decided that the experience fulfilled some need in them, and continues to seek that experience again: every thing that happens to them is perceived to be an attack, and their attitude becomes that of deserving special treatment because they are a victim, repeatedly, over and over. It is a rather disgusting and public type of self-pity.
A victim who moves on - who uses their experience to grow and mature, who reaches a hand back to help others who have experienced the same thing, who exposes the evil that made them a victim - these are not people with a "victim mentality", and anyone who says so needs to get their definitions sorted out.
So far I've read nothing on this blog that indicates a "victim mentality".
Just sayin.
You are so right Esther. They are no longer being forced to live the role of a "victim". It sounds like they all have moved on to the role of victor! Being a victim of rape, accidents, arson, robbery, etc....well you are a victim of a criminal act and therefore a victim of crime statistic for the rest of your life. So, yes, they are labled by society as being a victim of a cult. However, they all seem to have take the higher road and become victors over their past. Had they not chosen to step up and be victors then they would not be involved in helping others to steer clear of said cult.
Your name is from the Bible and the woman that carried that name was a victim. She was used and abused by various men in her life. However, like these folks on Recovering Grace, she too used her past to help those in her present and future. We need more believers to stand up and help others take off their spiritual blinders. It sounds dreadfully painful to have fellow believers show such contempt for a group who's sole purpose is to help others steer clear of a cult.
Kudos to this group! Esther, I pray that you never face anything in life that would label you, by society's standards, a victim...and if you ever find yourself being the victim of some henious crime or circumstances.....I'll bet this group would give you nothing but love and somewhere to heal.
Just sayin =)
Notice I put "victim mentality" in quotation marks. I would never use that phrase, but it has been used against me many times.
I realized that I was probably preaching to the choir, Darcy, but felt the distinction was edifying nonetheless. Renee, unfortunately I have been a victim, briefly of Bill Gothard's teaching (though much of that way of thinking stuck and stuck hard: I still have to fight it) and unfortunately of other false teachers and abusive pastors. I have also been a victim because my husband was killed in a hit-and-run accident 13 years ago, leaving me to raise my kids alone.
But in Christ, I am a conqueror, not a victim.
Esther, I'm so sorry. Big hugs to you! <3
Double Kudos to you Esther for being such an amazing victor! Glad you got out from under BG teaching so many years ago! Very sorry for your loss of a spouse....I am sure that you continued to be an amazing momma to ya'lls children! Hugs to you!
Great article! I love all the questions you asked. I believe that God seldom ever allows us to go through something that He doesn't intend for us share at some time with someone to help them through a difficult time for God's glory. What kind of testimony would it be for the Lord if we never shared how God brought us through a difficult situation? When something painful and tragic happens to us I don't think it's even possible to forget unless that tragedy included a brain injury. However, I do believe not only it is possible to forgive, but something that we are commanded in Scripture to do. Again, great article!
Excellent response, Darcy! Well said!! I think I'll be sharing this one!
It occurs to me that Paul did share but, he did not continue in a way that would cause others who take up this same torch to be bitter against those who were teaching them. That is to say that parents are perfect and should know better. They too make wrong choices sometimes and I agree that Bill G. was mistaken in his thinking and lumping everyone together but if you can't move on from the past or the past is being brought up all the time, how can one forgive and move on?
I don't believe it is healthy to encourage others to hang on to these things. It cause them to being unforgiving, the very thing I am sure you don't want and to throw things up in the face of their parents, who by the way, were misled. Is there any forgiveness for the parents or is it easier to blame it on them because they made a wrong choice. Forgiveness and moving on should be the objective.
I personally don't hear it as blame the parents, but finally having the freedom to say that my parents were WRONG - and not be in "rebellion" for declaring the truth. I still choose to forgive them for their choices.
Recovering Grace is one of the first websites that I've seen specifically designed for those who were under BG's teachings. It has brought so much freedom for me already, in hearing and sharing that I'm not alone. By people here speaking out, by them telling the truth, it has allowed me to extend grace to myself - and grace to my own parents who still don't think that there is anything wrong with these teachings. It has allowed healing in my heart towards them because it finally wasn't this huge secret.
By saying that the parents were misled, it feels to me that you are taking away from the truth that they CHOSE to listen, follow, and adopt these teachings.
It's because of others sharing their stories that I've been able to take a few more steps in moving forward in my own healing from my past. It's not sowing or encouraging bitterness, rather it's declaring hope that there is LIFE beyond what I've known and that it's a good life.
"...Paul did share but, he did not continue in a way that would cause others who take up this same torch to be bitter against those who were teaching them."
Ummm...
Maybe I'm misunderstanding you here, but Jesus' harshest words, and some of Paul's were directed at the kind of people Paul was before conversion.
Poor teaching, especially of the sort that adds works to the grace of God, in sanctification or salvation should and must be spoken out against.
Poor teaching results in poor application results in people being hurt...
and that needs to be discussed, one way or another.
Some of us must share these hard situation in order to heal and forgive. I am one of those people. For years I held the hurts of my childhood in and never experienced healing until I went to my pastor and poured all my hurts out to him. I then could begin to share about those stuations without feelings of pain that once left me crying everytime something reminded me of them. The more I share the less I feel the pain. This may not be true of all people. We cannot say that all who share are bitter and unforgiving.
Also, I agree with Tammy in that God can and often does use our testamony, good or bad, to show that His grace is sufficient.
Great thoughts Darcy! I totally agree with you and I think that people who seem to have such an issue with those who have been hurt not "moving on" are getting involved where maybe they shouldn't. I don't think I could ever go up to a rape victim and tell them to move on or change their attitude because I have never experienced such a horrible thing as they have. Why should I be calling them out or telling them how to deal with their hurt? Every person is different, and I think everyone heals in their own way.
Forgiveness is a goal, but I'm sure it can't happen overnight, and it would be wrong to demand so. It's a process. I just don't understand why people get so offended with another person's way of dealing with hurt when they have NO idea what that person has gone through. God calls us to love each other, and I think the most loving thing someone could do is take a hurting person where they are at and just be there for them, not condemn them or criticize them.
Thank you for being so honest and transparent. It is so refreshing!
"Forgiveness is a goal, but I'm sure it can't happen overnight, and it would be wrong to demand so. It's a process. I just don't understand why people get so offended with another person's way of dealing with hurt when they have NO idea what that person has gone through."
Yes, yes, and yes. =)
I was not as scarred or hurt as many who have shared on this site.
Yet I remember, that a year after leaving the training center, as I would try to talk about life there, I would get so tense I would be literally shaking all over. I tried to tell my concerned friends that I really wasn't upset, but by subconscious seemed to think otherwise.
It takes time, and each person recovers at their own pace and in their own way.
Keeping it all shut in helps no one.
Forgiveness seldom happens overnight. Forgiveness is possible, but it most often does take time. Usually involves working through a lot of things.
WOW!!! I really love this article!!! The analogy was so spot on!!! "The testimonies of the Lord are pure, making wise the simple!!!" He gives us these "pathways" out of our dark days and then wants us to show others the pathways as well!!!
"But if we ever forget where we came from, we will be just as lost as if we do not know where we are going."
I loved this!!!! EXACTLY!!!
Thanks so much for this article because now it is my valuable resource for those who would use these lines against me!!!
Hugs!!!!
One thought I just had, everyone has been through a "fire" and God WANTS us to use those experiences to help others!!!!
Because as I was sharing this article with my husband, (yes, I read and talk about all the articles here on recovering grace... I am addicted. :D) I realized that even though he didn't even know who Gothard was until he met me, he had rough experiences in his childhood that God had healed him of!!! Because he allowed God to heal him, he is a better man, husband, and dad and he can use those experiences to help others.
Again, proof of a really great article!!!! It has really got me thinking!!!
So, not to mention that the Phillipians passage has nothing to do with "getting over" something bad that happened to you. The things that were "behind" Paul were his phariseeical works of self-righteousness. What he was "getting over" was the idea that any of his good works carried any merit before God.
Yes, thank you Hannah. =)
Thanks for your blog. Sometimes it feels as though we are still expected to go through life with a big piece of duct-tape over our mouths.
Such amazing words, Darcy! Sometimes using the reality of our past is a powerful thing. I don't hear any hatred in your words. What I hear is that you KNOW, first hand, what it is like to be hurt from life inside an abusive cult. And that, because you know what that experience can entail, you want to do all you can to help others avoid hurt, and learn that there is peace and hope outside the rigidness that you've lived before. That is so beautiful. If that is what you do with your unwillingness to forget your past, I hope you always hold onto it and protect the reality of your history with ferocity. Because it is amazing.
Also, I don't hear an eagerness to place blame in your voice. You want healing for everyone impacted by Gothard's teaching. And part of that involves owning up to horrible things that some of us have done. You aren't looking for vengeance. You aren't trying to hurt anyone. So much is summed up in your last sentence:
"and let the shame roll off your back and into the gutter where it belongs."
THAT is about love, healing, and forgiveness. So, while you want those who have hurt you to stop hurting you, and to understand that much of what they have done has been harmful or even cruel, I am hearing that you want them to find the same healing you've found. I love it. Thank you for sharing this with us. I think I could learn a lot from you.
Curtis, thank you for your kind, encouraging words. They really meant a lot to me. :)
I struggle with this all the time. I find it in my heart to forgive, and I become motivated to move on with life. Then something creeps up. The past will always affect the present and threaten the future. There's no way to turn back the clock to salvage missed opportunities any more than we can correct the past wrongs.
Jenny, it is totally normal to go through "layers" of healing. So often, I will deal with something and move on. Then, something else will come up, or something deeper from a previously dealt with pain. Each time, the healing goes deeper. When something creeps up, it means you are healing more. It does not mean that you have regressed. :)
These are some great thoughts, Darcy. They really got me to thinking...
God redeems our life stories. He doesn't throw them away as if they are irrelevant. He breathes new life into us, and pours life out of our brokenness and healing into others as well.
I heard someone say that there is a difference between "sharing" your story and "bleeding" your story. Certainly there are people who bleed all over the place and they need healing. But healing doesn't come through a lobotomy so that they no longer remember the painful past - it comes through Jesus redeeming the pain and making something new and life-giving out of it.
This is a wonderful article. When Gothardites say that, they are really saying, "Don't expose our abusive pracrices."
Or, as I have been recently reminded,
"YOU were the one who decided to get more involved (i.e., spend 3 yrs at a TC), it's your OWN fault! Don't you dare imply your parents share any of the blame!"
Yah. Much encouragement received, thankya kindly. =)
Philippians 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things. 9Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you.
Pay close attention to the last part.........
Victims have no peace, they have turmoil. They need peace. They should want to get on with their life. Look at what the Word says to do to get peace.
If somebody is a victim, then they have a story. The story will be full of things opposite of what God tells us to think on.
Everybody is a victim in some way or another. I am a victim of many things that happened in my growing up years, my teen years, my young married life and my older life as a pastor's wife. I had a pastor in Dallas that calls Philippians 4:8 the 'Limitation of thought' verse. What we think on directs our every step. If we change what we think on, we will change.
Try this: think on the things that scare you most or upset you. Cancer. Bulldogs on your jogging path. Death of a spouse. Heights. Family members... Car wrecks. If you just sit and think about these things...........you will not have peace.
It's as simple as counting sheep. Concentration on something that will relax and bring sleep/peace means you are making *stay awake thoughts*, FLEE. Counting sheep DOES help you go to sleep if you do it right.
That same pastor had me memorize James 4:7..........submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil and he shall flee from you.
Any hurtful thought can be taken care of by thinking about something else. Something good. It is possible. The less you think about what made you a victim..........the less of a victim you will become.
When somebody (like me) encourages others to GO ON with their lives, we are accused of never being through anything hard ourselves. Not so. I was not brought up in a Christian home, my parents both drank, cussed and threw things. I was sexually abused as a young girl and have been pulled through a knot-hole backwards by thoughtless church members. I can't change any of those things, but i CAN change what I think about.
Thinking about our past doesn't mean we're controlled by it and can't move on. In fact, I believe it is healthy to process it. I find, the more I process, the less emotionally torn up I feel about it, and the better able I actually am to move on. No, repression is not the solution. There is a place for healthy review and processing.
So basically ignore everything bad, only think happy thoughts, and you won't have a care in the world. That's what you seem to be saying. Of course ignoring bad stuff is going to help you feel better about your life. It's called "denial". It's a coping mechanism used by people who can't handle dealing with the junk in their lives or don't know how. I used to do it all the time. Sometimes I still do. I would never advise people to do this. Because I've learned that everything is beautiful in it's time: life AND death, health AND sickness, laughter AND mourning (Eccl. 3). If you want to only look at health and life and laughter, you can pretend sickness and death and mourning don't exist and you might have a happier life. Until you get sick and die or that happens to someone you love. Don't divorce yourself from reality just because it's not pretty. I don't think Phil. 4 is saying what you seem to think it's saying. If it is, then Paul didn't even follow his own instructions in 2 Cor. when he devoted a whole chapter to talking about all the horrendous things he suffered. You may want to rethink your approach.
As a parent, if my daughter/son needed to vent about me on the internet, I would take it as an undeniable sign that I appeared unapproachable to them on the subject, and some humility would be in order on my part. Knowing my brother was offended (my children are also my brethren in Christ), I would go and seek to be reconciled to my brother.
If my brother (even if my child as well) rebukes me for offending him, my obligation is to repent. When I repent, my brother's obligation (even if my child) is to forgive me. I should make every effort to repair the broken relationship on my part, and not withhold fellowship or comfort, but love freely as the Lord loves me.
Being a parent doesn't give me any "out" in such a situation. In fact, if my children felt they could not approach me or believed I would remain unrepentant if they had ought against me without even trying to show me my fault, then I would feel dishonored by them. I consider it honorable treatment for them to believe I am interested in their hearts, that I very much care about their thoughts on our relationship, and that I will own up to any responsibility on my part to make things right.
Mine are twenty-one and seventeen now, and I hope they know that they can come to me about anything. If I am in stubborn defiance refusing to "hear my brother", they can and should take it to the whole world. I would rather suffer public shame for my faults than be estranged from my children.
shadowspring, how I WISH my parents had your attitude. And you said EXACTLY what I wish I knew how to say to them. They would just see us venting online as gossip, and condemn us heavily for it.. nevermind that they've lied TO OUR FACES time and again about all kinds of things...
There is a song by Allan Asbury..."Someone is praying me through".
Perhaps those that are still working through everything would benefit more by a "fellow christian" telling them they are praying them through versus telling them to get over it or just move on.
right on Renee! I have benefited more from that attitude than the just get over it one.
It is the dwelling on the pain that makes it worse.
1
: to remain for a time
2
a : to live as a resident
The world calls is repression............I choose to move on.
The world calls it hashing it out in our mind.....I choose to move on.
A merry heart doeth good like a medicine........a broken spirit drieth the bones.
Choose how you want to live.
I disagree. Repressing things and NOT facing them, NOT acknowledging them, NOT dealing with them, and then after that moving on, led me down a suicidal path because there was more pressure than I could handle, and I didn't even know where the pressure was coming from.
I think I understand what you are trying to say, but for someone who is coming out of ATI and is completely confused, scared, can't tell which end of them is up because the rug has been yanked out from underneath them, they need to KNOW what's going on in their own heads, so they can grow up, heal properly, go through the grieving stage, so that they can get to the point where they can finally move on.
I think you misunderstand that many of us here at at some point or other in the stages I just described. We aren't able to move on YET because we still have broken bones or gaping wounds that need to be tended to.
[...] I cannot. It just doesn’t work that way. My Personal Response to Why Don’t You Just Move On? [...]
[...] one or more of the following: “You’re just bitter; you need to forgive your enemy and move on; stop blaming someone else for your problems; you should be on your knees asking God to help you; [...]
As my mom would say, "Walk a mile in my shoes, then come tell me about it." I was emotionally, mentally and spiritually abused growing up, with some physical thrown in. Took until I'd been home from college for almost a year and turned 20 to put a name to what I'd experienced. When someone screws with your head or brainwashes you, it can take a while to get back on your feet. Sometimes it takes a lifetime. Just be there for someone who's been through it. Let them vent. If they have to tell their life story 100 times to make sense of it, let them. Support them and be there for them.