22 Comments

1. 

   Will June 30, 2014 Reply

   WOW! Great article! This articulated exactly what I was trying to communicate to someone the other day when I was trying to explain the danger of studying and reading the Bible the "Gothard" way. You cannot build your whole theology and overall perception of the Bible & God based on what you consider to be a "Personal Rhema."

   • 

     Dave July 3, 2014 Reply

     Interesting point on commentaries. In our ATI circles, the only authoritative references were Strongs and Youngs.
     
     Interesting outcome though, as Bill rejected commentaries in favor of the "raw, unadulterated text" he ended up writing some pubs that come dangerously close to being the same conceptually as ... wait for it... commentaries.
     
     Therefore, should we accept Bill's advice to eshue all other-textly publications and focus only on the Scripture?
     
     That sounds like pretty good advice.

     • 

       greg r July 3, 2014 Reply

       Interesting outcome though, as Bill rejected commentaries in favor of the "raw, unadulterated text" he ended up writing some pubs that come dangerously close to being the same conceptually as ... wait for it... commentaries
       
       Forget "CLOSE": the only difference between Bill's work and that of respected scholars/theologians is ....wait for it....scholarship. Scholarship and "rhema" need not be opposed. Gnostic dualism, anyone ?? Unless someone wants to argue that Bill's 'scholarship' is God's way, and the work of NT Wright and friends is something else.

       • 

         Guy Cooksey July 3, 2014

         BG's "rhemas"have always bothered me--as if only he had the true message from God for all of us underlings. Dr. Ron Allen's excellent rebuke of BG is a must read for everyone. In short, BG cannot be trusted with the scripture.

2. 

   LynnCD June 30, 2014 Reply

   Someone once said Gothard Scotch tapes Bible verses on his own ideas to make them appear biblical when they are not. I think that is an accurate portrayal of many of his teachings. To be fair and clear, it is only proper to give an example when making an accusation like this. Yesterday I recalled a teaching of Gothard that the Botkin sisters ran with, and that is making a slur against wives who work outside the home by claiming they are as bad as prostitutes, or by saying whatever they do is to be compared to the work of a prostitute. Bill Gothard out and outright said of of working mothers that they fail the test of virtue because they work. The Scripture he tapes on this teaching is Proverbs 7:11, where the prostitute is described as loud and defiant, and her feet never stay at home. You have to ask does this Scripture mean in and of itself that all work that a wife and mother may do outside the home automatically make her a sleazy woman who neglects her home. The answer is no. That was Gothard's idea. He misused the holy Word of God to foist his idea on people

   • 

     LynnCD June 30, 2014 Reply

     (whoops, hit send too soon) He misused the holy Word of God to foist his idea on people who don't bother to carefully study the Bible for themselves.

     • 

       Julia Fetters July 1, 2014 Reply

       I remember that teaching. wow. bad memory of him saying those words.

       • 

         LynnCD July 1, 2014

         Sorry for bringing up a bad memory, Julia.

3. 

   Vanessa June 30, 2014 Reply

   Wonderful article! One other point --- butchers cut out portions they think are not useful for their purposes. As others have pointed out, Gothard had no use for the epistle to the Galatians.

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     LynnCD June 30, 2014 Reply

     Yes, also Acts15 is not useful to Gothard as well.

     • 

       Vanessa June 30, 2014 Reply

       Excellent point!! Also Matt. 15:9.

     • 

       Andrew June 30, 2014 Reply

       Unfortunately it isn't just Gothard who finds Acts 15 not useful, or attempt to redefine what Acts 15 really says.

4. 

   Will Hunsucker June 30, 2014 Reply

   I still cannot fathom how so many people were so desperate for a new "Prophet" with all the right formulas to make their marriages successful, their children obedient, and their billfolds full that they were willing to ignore the very basics of Bible study. (Or even basic thinking.)
   
   Gothard's misuse of Scripture flies so fast and thick from the first minutes of his BS that you don't even have to search to find examples of him proof texting. Anecdote+'Principle'(backed up by prooftext) = God's Ineffable Word in Gothard World.
   
   That's not even mentioning the reams of printed materials. For a protestant culture that claims to hold to 'Sola Scriptura,' somehow a whole generation or two were willing to swallow 'Sola Gotharda.' His record as a teacher of his own opinions 'backed' by proof texts should be enough to discredit the man as a teacher, even without his atrocious record with female assistants, enabling abuse, etc.
   
   Thanks for emphasising this!

   • 

     Jerrod Forrest June 30, 2014 Reply

     Will,
     
     You make a good point, wondering how so many were taken in for so long. Perhaps there's a base-chord in human nature
     that's strongly attracted to "get rich quick" thinking, even as it applies to the soul. If I recall the climate from my own
     evangelical church in the early 1980s, with its "don't spread an evil report" instruction, and heavy emphasis on
     maintaining outward appearances, it seems logical that Gothardism's tainted theology was stealthily making its way into
     American congregations.
     
     Even a recent conversation I had with two adult friends in their 40s and 50s gave me the notion that over the past 25-30
     years, they too, had picked up elements of this false teaching, based on their citing evidence of one-party vote assemblies,
     and the concept of a condemnatory Father God figure, vs. One who is compassionate, understanding and merciful. Neither
     of them had actually even heard of Bill Gothard or ATI, but attributable to the latter's decades' long litany of heresies, they
     had nonetheless been exposed to, and in some cases swallowed the lies they'd heard in their own fellowships.
     
     As a result of poring over RG accounts since the beginning of this year, I was able to recount to them some very Good News
     examples of divine, unmerited grace, which we understand has not only taken on legalism with its shame, unhealthy pride
     and fear-based shackles, but has gloriously blown it to pieces. All things considered, I suppose it's far less difficult - after
     having checked one's brains in at the door - to walk comfortably behind someone we think is blazing a trail in the wilderness,
     while simultaneously imagining that we're making warp-speed, spiritual progress. When the path turns into quicksand,
     however, or leads the sheep over a cliff (most often detected by those outside the bubble), it's time to place our full trust in
     Him who calmed the waters, and loves us more deeply than our finite minds could ever grasp.

   • 

     Dave July 1, 2014 Reply

     Will Hunsucker - Long time since crossings days, huh? :)
     
     - theman

   • 

     Guy Cooksey July 3, 2014 Reply

     Will: the problem is that we are lazy by nature and will accept second-hand (and often false) "truths" that we think will make us happier and richer. We refuse to take the time to read our Bibles and mine the word of God for ourselves, and then use only solid scholarship instead of populist folk-theology. We think that BG has done the 'mining" for us and unlocked the core truths that will lead to fulfillment. Throw in a few stories of changed lives and "presto!" we have all we need to be happy. It's all deceptive malarkey, but we think it is the key truths from God's man.

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     rob war July 8, 2014 Reply

     you point out the weakness of Sola Scriptura and the difficulty on deciding who is right or the correct interpretation. Martin Luther said towards the end of his life that he out rid of one pope but now has 100 more popes. Lots of people can quote the Bible and then use it and twist it for their one false views and convince a lot of gullible but sincere Christians to go along.

5. 

   greg r July 3, 2014 Reply

   @ the RG community at large: would greatly recommend David Fitch's post of July 2, regarding airing dirty laundry (when is this helpful, when is it not). The comment section is rich as well, with comments from Bill Kinnon, whom I appreciate and respect. The themes will look VERY familiar to much of what the RG community has, and will, talk about.
   
   Have a July 4th FREE in Christ, the only true freedom.

   • 

     greg r July 3, 2014 Reply

     Fithch's blog is (I think) Recovering the Mission.

6. 

   Karen July 8, 2014 Reply

   A few observations from an Eastern Orthodox perspective:
   
   Act 8:28-31 - The Jews of Jesus' day assumed they needed guidance to understand the Scriptures (even though the literate also read the Scriptures for themselves).
   
   2 Peter 3:15-17 - The Scriptures are not all perspicacious and self-interpreting--the "untaught and unstable" can twist the words of Scripture to their own destruction.
   
   Luke 24:25-27 - Even after sitting under His teaching for three years, Jesus' disciples were clueless as to the way in which their OT Scriptures spoke of Christ until guided by Christ Himself in their understanding. Significant portions of the spiritual meaning of the Scriptures is not apparent on the merely literal level of the texts. Have you ever wondered why so many of the ways the Messianic prophetic OT texts are quoted and interpreted in the NT defy the rules we moderns have come to accept as normative in the interpretation of Scripture (i.e., some variation of the historical/textual-critical method)? The way in which the OT Scriptures "speak of Christ" (John 5:39) is more hidden than many assume and cannot be discerned apart encounter with Christ Himself in His Church. A lot of doctrinal error has slipped into many corners of Christendom because the OT is appropriated and used in a way not sanctioned in the NT. It is only in knowing the full story revealed in Christ, that we come to understand the place of the rest of the Scriptures in their proper context.
   
   1 Corinthians 2 - The Holy Spirit's work is key to understanding God's word. We can't understand God's word aright until the Holy Spirit is at work in our hearts and through God’s messengers demonstrating the truth of Christ and transforming us into His image.
   
   Acts 15 - The Holy Spirit resides fully, not in any one single believer alone, but in the whole Church Christ founded. When the whole Church gathers in good faith to cooperate with one another and seek the Spirit's guidance in council to discern how the Scriptures and the truth of the gospel are to be applied in the face of controversies and new situations, we can trust the Holy Spirit to guide that process and deliver a consensus that remains faithful to the apostolic deposit of truth.
   
   To properly interpret the Scriptures, context is everything. It is key to know which Scriptures must give the context for all the rest. For the Jews, the Torah (the Pentateuch) was/is central to understanding the rest of the OT Scriptures, then came the prophets and so on down in a hierarchy of importance. For the apostolic early Christians, it was the Gospels that formed the proper context through which to read all the rest of the Scripture, next the epistles, then the Torah, etc.
   
   In the early Church, new converts typically underwent three years of instruction as catechumens before they were baptized, and they were not taught the meaning of the rites of the Church in baptism, laying on of hands/anointing and participation in the Eucharist until after they were baptized and had experienced them. In this view, participation in the Church and obedience to Christ are prerequisites to understanding the meaning of much of the Scriptures and the interior life of the Church (which is the context for the writings of the epistles). Since 1973 when this article was written, more western scholars have become aware of early evidence, such as that found in the “Didache” (written shortly before the turn of the 2nd century), which like the "Apostolic Constitutions" and other such early records of details of Church life -- describe the practices of the apostolic Church. It is not true, actually, that we don’t know how baptisms were conducted, how the Eucharist was administered, and the manner of ordination, etc., in the apostolic and early ante-Nicene and Nicene periods of the Church. It’s true not many of the details are given in the Scriptures, but they have all been quite thoroughly described in documents of the early Church. In the NT, St. Paul charges the early churches to which he wrote to "keep the apostolic teaching" whether it was delivered by epistle or by word of mouth (2 Thessalonians 2:15), so it is reasonable to expect that we will see continuity of practice in this early period with the apostolic norms imparted to the NT churches. I’m currently reading Tradition, Scripture, and Interpretation , Edited by D. H. Williams (and published by Baker Academic), which is a good, very accessible resource for those wanting to gain a better understanding of the history of Christians’ interpretation and application of the Scriptures in the early period.

7. The Boxes and the Biases | You Said; I Thought July 9, 2014 Reply

   […] But what I hear is that every single scripture pertains to their particular agenda. Bernard Ramm wrote, “My study Bible has 1512 pages. Some place in these 1512 pages I can usually manage to find […]

8. 

   rob war August 1, 2018 Reply

   Jesus stated himself that He is the fulfillment of the law and that the law and the prophets testify of Him. The NT is hidden in the OT and the OT is revealed in the NT. On the road to Emmaus, Jesus opened scripture to the two unnamed disciples in how the OT (no NT yet) predicted Him. The Bible is not a how to book but a who is book. In Acts, Phillip explained the passage in Isaiah to the Ethiopian in how it related to Jesus. This is how the early Church used scripture. Therefore, when someone comes along and tells you that the Bible is the answer book about everything else, one should realize that this is a false use of scripture. When the devil tempted Jesus, he took isolated verses out of context to tempt Jesus. Jesus counted with scripture himself.