At the age of 15, I had already been heavily enslaved to a serious eating disorder for five years. According to my psychologist/counselor at the time, the eating disorder was accompanied by Borderline Personality Disorder and clinical depression. He prescribed three different medications that gave me headaches and made me more irritable–they didn’t really solve any problems. I seemed to be an introvert, but I excelled in many talents such as music, literature, and art.
Still, my parents thought that I needed “fixing.” We had recently relocated to the Midwest, and my new piano teacher was very involved with the Advanced Training Institute (ATI). The girls in her family dressed in ankle-length skirts, maintained natural-looking, frizzy hair, and wore virtually no make-up. The boys wore waist-high pants with old-fashioned belts and buttoned-up dress shirts on almost every occasion. To me, having grown up on the West Coast, they were strange. And in my opinion, eight children and two parents seemed to be a crazy amount of mouths to feed. I did not know that ATI families could easily have as many as 14 to 16 children, with the oldest practically raising the youngest ones.
My mom was exasperated with my self-destructive ways. She spoke with my piano teacher’s mother during my piano lesson one day and was convinced to take my father and me to the Basic Seminar held at their church. Thus I sat in an old church, tired and groggy, having to write notes and pay attention even though it was always late at night and I had school in the morning. There I was, listening to Bill Gothard talk about depression as selfishness and psychological disorders as false, man-made excuses.
Within a few weeks, I was sent to the Indianapolis Training Center (ITC) for a visit. Upon my arrival for a two-day stay, all the occupants of the old hotel building stared at me with shocked interest. I was already being judged as the girl wearing pants and too much make-up.
I wondered why I saw some of the other kids my age walking or sitting between two older peers, always with their heads down and never talking. I noticed them surreptitiously staring at me from the corners of their eyes, as if they did not want their older peers, standing around them like bodyguards, to see them looking at someone so different.
One month later, I was sent to the ITC as a Leader In Training (LIT). My belongings were searched–without my consent and not in my presence. The family in charge of the LIT program at the time had smiled at me and told me to just leave it in the office so someone else could help carry it up to my room. I gratefully agreed; I didn’t know that it would be searched. They took away my personal journal, my make-up, my medications, my books, some clothes, and my razors.
I was sent into a room with a few girls who were called my “leaders.” There, I was told the rules of the ITC that I, as an LIT, would be expected to follow:
- I was not allowed to speak to anyone except my leaders.
- I was not allowed to look at or talk to boys. Ever.
- I would never be allowed to talk to the other LITs.
- I was not allowed to use razors to shave.
- I was not allowed to take my medication, as believing in psychological disorders was a sin.
- I was not allowed to read any reading material or listen to any music that was not approved.
- All of my mail and letters would be sorted through and read before I was allowed to have them.
- I was not allowed to wear make-up for a month.
(They later told me I wasn’t allowed to have make-up at all, until my mom called them to complain that make-up was permitted in our home. The leader of the ITC brought me into her office to make fun of me for having my mom call about this, which I don’t understand since Bill Gothard dyes his hair black and alters his appearance.)
- I wasn’t allowed to keep a journal.
- I wasn’t allowed to talk to my parents during the time I was in the room (two to four weeks) and after that time I could only talk to them for ten minutes once a week–and that call would be monitored.
- They almost made me stop crossing myself in the familiar gesture I was accustomed to before and after each prayer, having been raised in a Catholic Christian home. They told me Catholicism was a cult.
Surprised by my extreme obedience, as I also have obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD) and tend to do everything “to the T,” they let me out of the room after just one week. It was Christmas. Some holiday, I thought, as my team and a couple of other people were put in charge of the kitchen because most of the staff families had left.
I was 15 years old and began working 48 hours in the kitchen every week, not realizing that it was common practice for the LITs to work 48 to 56 hours on kitchen prep, housekeeping, and other hotel responsibilities during huge conferences. Constantly exhausted, I found little time to rest, because we began to do group Bible studies every waking hour. They changed our rooms and our leaders constantly, so that we would not become too familiar or comfortable with the ones we had.
It seemed as if I were automatically judged for being an LIT, even though I didn’t fit the usual criteria. Others had gotten in trouble for drugs, grand theft auto, and other serious crimes, and they seemed accustomed to being violent. I, however, was the girl with the eating disorder and depression. But the leaders never seemed to address the eating issues, just the fact that I was “conflicted youth”–and a Catholic.
I did enjoyed the music at the training center, however. I was fortunate enough to be given permission to receive private music theory lessons, and I studied with one of the greatest piano teachers I have ever had while at the ITC. And I think that I did learn a lot. I was allowed to participate in banquet serving and professional-level decorating for formal dining. I also learned to work hard and to put all my effort and honesty in doing all to the glory of God.
The worst incident that I endured started one afternoon, after school at the Learning Center. I returned to the room before dinner and was told that they had found the secret journal I had stashed behind my pillow. I had a lot of pent-up feelings and anxiety issues; writing and praying was the easiest way for me to ease my pain. They explained that they had read every word of my journal and then demanded that I answer some questions that they had about certain parts I had written. I broke down into tears, and, sobbing, explained to them that I was sorry. Then I tore up my journal in front of them. They also took away my book of poems that I would often write in front of them, and told me I was no longer allowed to write. I have never gotten my book of poems back.
It is hardest to deal with the way I was treated when I had a brief conversation with another LIT during school. We secretly passed each other notes. We found that we had a lot in common and promised each other we would be friends as soon as we got out. She told me she saved my phone number and address in her journal. I panicked, and warned her that they read our journals when they find them. She told me not to worry. She told me we were safe.
A week later, I saw her through the open glass windows of the LIT office. Her eyes were wide with fear and glossy with tears while her leaders sat on either side of her with disapproving, silent frowns. At that moment, I knew what was about to happen. My leaders punished me with silence as we went through the buffet line for dinner. Silence as we ate our food. Silence as we finished our chores. We went up to our room and continued to clean. I could tell by the way they were behaving that I was in trouble again.
A little while later, we went downstairs to the office. I had learned the way of sneaking side glances through the corners of my eyes–like those LITs I had seen on my first visit so long ago–so I saw the papers labeled “Projects” that the new LIT family leader held in her hands as we passed the glass windows of the office. “Projects” were indigenous to the Prayer Room. We sat down and she lectured me. She told me that what I had done actually put my weekend plans in jeopardy. It was to be my first visit with my family, at home, in over 11 months. It was a four-hour drive from my home to Indianapolis. I asked the LIT leader if she had told my mom that she might not be able to come after all. The LIT family leader said that she hadn’t, not yet anyway.
Knowing my fate, my leaders led me as a prisoner to the Prayer Room, aka Solitary Confinement. It was an empty room. The windows were barred with metal bars. The only furniture was a small twin bed and a small circular table and chair to do my written Project assignments on. There was a bathroom with the mirrors ripped out. Previous LITs had apparently carved words into the walls of the room. I felt as if I were a mental patient in a psychiatric ward, only treated worse.
Due to the permanent damage to my body resulting from my eating disorder, I am now constantly dehydrated, have low blood pressure, orthostatic hypotension, electrolyte imbalances, anemia, and extremely dry skin. I was in the Prayer Room for only a day when my skin began to itch from dryness. My mouth, too, was dry, so when my leaders would show up twice a day with food (and they always seemed to bring me food I disliked the most), I would ask for extra water and some chapstick next time they came. They always promised to “ask permission” from the LIT family leader.
I never got the chapstick or extra water. Instead, I was constantly thirsty and my lips became so chapped that they cracked and bled. I could barely move my lips to talk without pain. I sat on my bed instead of sitting at the table to do my projects because I was lethargic due to dehydration and lack of food.
Many of the projects were assignments in memorizing whole chapters of the Bible. I did so with my usual ease, and was lectured for memorizing everything too fast. They told me I was supposed to reflect on the work, not rush through all the assignments, and that I would get more assignments as soon as I finished anyway. Afraid of becoming punished more, I refrained from telling them that I was just learning at my usual pace–I assumed it would be perceived as talking back. I also got in trouble for not fixing my bed once, because I was sitting on it.
The LIT family leader told me that my visit home was still in jeopardy (it was supposed to be the next day) and that I would probably not be able to go. Again fearing a reprimand, I didn’t remind her of what she already knew: that my mom would be driving four hours to Indianapolis, and that she would be furious if she came all that way, was not able to see me, and had to drive all the way home alone.
My mom arrived at the ITC and they hadn’t told her all that was going on. They let me leave the Prayer Room to pack my belongings. As I got my luggage, I told myself that I would never, ever come back to this place. I crammed everything I could into the suitcases, while listening to my leaders tell me that it wasn’t necessary for me to take everything home at this time. I smiled and told them I just wanted to be prepared, and explained that most of my clothes at home didn’t fit me anymore–which was true.
Mom and I walked to the elevators and out the door. Mom helped me throw my luggage into her SUV and we drove away. As we drove on the highways, I noticed a difference in the cars–as if I had suddenly fast-forwarded to the future; it also seemed that way as I heard about movies and other things that had come out while I was an LIT. I felt as if I had lost a year. I was now 16, but I felt as if I were 30. A couple of days later, at home, I had a long talk with my parents, and they were convinced that I should stay home.
For a couple years after I left the training center for good, I still felt that I was sinning if I even looked at a boy or dressed in pants at all. I couldn’t help but constantly read the books they had given to me, almost as if in fear that in not doing so I would become ungodly and a failure. It took a while for me to become normal again. And it also took me a long while to realize that I could wear pants and wear make-up the way I liked it, be married and have a career, and still love and serve the Lord my God.
Christina was an LIT at the Indianapolis Training Center from 2003 to 2004. She currently works in Global Engineering for an international company and is married to a soldier in the American military. They have one child.
January 23, 2020
Wow, if this isn't a description of a cult, I sure don't know what is.
How is it those who treated this young women in such a harsh and unloving manner could think they were obeying Christ when He tells us what love is.How can christians accept these teachings from Gothard when Gal' warn us of such teaching?
So sorry, Christina... Not only the social isolation, but then to deny you your physical and medical needs, is incomprehensible. And what idiot forces you to quit psychotropic medications cold turkey without a doctor's supervision?! Definitely playing with fire, there!! It makes me so mad! Stories like this make me feel ashamed that I was ever involved in the organization in any way, shape, or form.
I too found the withholding of medications to be idiotic and dangerous to those in care of the institute. I am a bit shocked that this would be done with out the consultation of a physician. When I stayed at the ITC I did not work with the L.I.T.'s, but they were some of my favorite people there. I knew some of the L.I.T. Leaders, and most really wanted to minister to, not harm the kids they worked with (although I do remember one leader getting sent to the prayer room after hitting a L.I.T.) Unfortunately, having good intentions does not take away the pain caused by these abusive tactics. I hope that your story will help those doing all the wrong things with all the best intentions, see the errors in this system. Thank you for being brave enough to share your story. I am sure it must bring up a lot of unpleasant memories.
Be careful 'Hanna' not to take up an offense, perhpas you can check out the red book and see what cnosequences await you if you do ...
"Grateful" I had to laugh when I read your "tongue in cheek comment" - uh, I do hope it was "tongue in cheek"! How beautiful it is to see Hannah's anger at the wrong that was done to Christina! Here's a great quote about anger "Anger is not evil; anger is not sinful; anger is not part of our fallen nature; anger is not Satan at work in our lives. Quite the contrary. Anger is evidence that we are made in God's image; it demonstrates that we still have some concern for justice and righteousness in spite of our fallen estate. The capacity for anger is strong evidence that we are more than mere animals. It reveals our concern for rightness, justice and fairness. The experience of anger is evidence of our nobility, not our depravity" Gary Chapman, The Other Side of Love.
Wow, Hope--that's an amazing quote! Love it!
"Hope," for sure tongue in cheek :)
WOW!!! Very brave Christina!! Thank you so much for sharing this with us!!! I am confident that God will use this for good and for His glory to help others!!!
I am so sorry that it happened at all.
Its sad to say that I played a role as a leader in an LIT situation and as the receiving end in the Prayer Room while as a leader...and an LIT. I can understand wanting to follow everything to the letter assuming that the leadership is always right and you are always wrong.
After I left Life Focus and Life Focus Advanced...I had months of re-building emotionally and I'm sooo glad that ITC is NOT IN USE ANYMORE.
I was also an LIT leader and that place didn't teach me anything good at all, I went back home sad and trying to live a ''good'' life under their teachings (failing of course). I feel so bad for the girl that was my LIT, she had such a horrible past and it seamed that no one really cared about helping her to heal. I AM ALSO SO GLAD THAT PLACE IS GONE! I got in trouble for counting dawn the days to be out of that place, the day of my graduation the person in charge of the whole place invited me to come back whenever i wanted to, but NO THANKS...The only person that can change your life is Jesus Christ, NOT Mr. Gothard, his teachings lack of the TRUE GOSPEL, the might ''seem'' helpful to live a ''holly'' life, but it will be a fake life because you are only doing it because someone else told you to and if you don't do it they point fingers at you. It is sad but the worst people I have met and been around have been part of IBLP... I really hope that they can open their eyes and see that there is something better in Jesus ONLY, not in some 10-step list to conquer something...
I have a really hard time with a lot of the "ATI/Bill Gothard ruined my life" stories. While you have a lot of instances where a set of parents didn't really do the best thing for their child or a teacher didn't understand what their student was going through, I think that the majority of these articles place blame in the wrong places and demonize the whole institution because of their experience. I don't see this as any different than the guy who demonizes all Christians because of his dogmatic parents who didn't allow him any freedom and his out of touch pastor.
You can't justify atheism because of your own parents or pastor, and you can't condemn all of ATI and or IBLP because of your experience.
In addition, the stereotypical derogatory 'ATI family description' is unfair to anyone who doesn't dress like that and attempts to paint ATI as an organization that forces everyone to dress like that. This is simply untrue and fallacious.
It's true that not everyone in the program was unreasonable and abusive. In fact, many were not. I don't believe RG is saying that they all were.
However, surely in reading this story, you see how out-of-balance the particular methods in this story are. If it was just one story, I would not have believed it, either. Until I began to hear story upon story, many of them the experiences of good friends of mine, so that I could no longer doubt their veracity.
I encourage you to check out the "Twisted Scriptures" section on this website, to see exactly where Bill Gothard himself is at fault; i.e., the false teachings. He doesn't get to teach principles and concepts which are ultimately unhealthy and damaging, then get a free pass, as, "It's the fault of the followers if it doesn't work out." Nuh-uh.
Hey Adam, there is a broad spectrum of former ATI students and experiences, and I'm not sure exactly what you have in mind in your comment. It is surely true that a person needs to take responsibility for their own choices without blaming parents or Gothard or others.
I am surprised by your comment that the organization does not pressure people to dress a certain way. It's very interesting to me that some people are experiencing this program as a place where they are free to wear what they want. I think many of us would have had a significantly different experience in our formative years if our experience had involved such personal freedom of choice.
It was my experience that there was tremendous, constant pressure to conform to the look. This included hair styles for both men and women, and dress codes for both. Families were judged based on their family photos. Students were judged based on conformance to the look. This was a major deal for us as students because we were not allowed to go to college; it certainly felt to me as if my career choices were ATI or nothing. The judgement based on arbitrary appearances was constant and pervasive and the consequences were deep for anyone who was judged to not conform. I saw girls getting a talking-to for not having curly enough of hair, I saw a girl getting ripped on for wearing hiking boots (in winter, in Moscow, in snow and ice), I saw boys being "frozen out" over things like nonstandard haircuts (not wildly different haircuts, just more faddish). No dads with beards were allowed into the program - if a dad had a beard it was demanded that he shave. (there is a story involving beards and politics here: http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2003/marchweb-only/3-3-33.0.html )
This site is amazing, I never realised all this about ATI (I married in). My experiences with IBLP has been pretty much all positive thus far (albeit from the periphery). Matthew, you post a lot here, what percentage of post-ATI/IBLP do you think this site represents?
grateful, I wish I knew. My family joined the second year of ATI. The first-year families were royalty. Those first-year families were the original 102 families that met at Northwoods in 1984. There was a breathless anticipation of what God was going to do with this "Godly generation", starting with the children from those 102. We were supposedly on the "cutting edge of revival."
I often wonder: Where are they now? As I understand it, some of those kids have gone on to do very well, some have really struggled, some have done prison time. Some remain people of faith, some have rejected religion entirely, still others have gone to Eastern thought. Some of those kids are very wounded souls.
There are certainly families who did OK. The families I know who did OK entered the program later in life and held it more at arm's length. I suspect that the majority of families experienced more harm than good but I may have a skewed perspective because I have heard too many stories of heartbreak. The program is not "self-correcting", that is, there is no built-in correction for an abusive family.
Eventually, someone will probably pressure Gothard enough to start publishing some of the stats. The thing to watch out for when he does is how well he reports the experiences of the students, not the parents. Many parents will report that the program worked fine even though their families are devastated in the aftermath. That was initially a surprise to me and I still don't fully understand it but I've come to expect it. I think one interesting stat would be how many second-generation students there are. By now, there should be thousands of them: Where are they?
It's intriguing to me that when I try to discuss the issue of "fruit" (meaning the fruit of ATI) with my own parents, they see it as a tragedy that people washed out rather than as the fruit of the legalism and efforts of flesh vs. Spirit.
I can say this with confidence as one who grew up in the program and trusted it completely: It does not deliver what it advertises.
btw, just so there's no confusion, I do enjoy the conversation here and I engage it a lot but I am not the admin of the site. I am part of one of the teams that writes for the site (though I have not written anything in a long time) and I am friends with the admins. I hope that I don't give anyone the wrong impression with my many comments :-)
grateful - do you have access to EBSCO? There was an article in "Christian Century" in 1974 by Bockelman. He has some amazingly perceptive comments in there, including this:
"History tells us what happens when well-meaning, deeply committed religious people substitute law for gospel — and what it tells us is not pleasant."
Matthew, you said that you often wonder what has happened to the first year families. I am from a first year family and can tell you that in my family's case we didn't end up to bad (at least compared to some of the families). But I will say that despite some great "accomplishments" as far as ATI is concerned I am in my late 20's and struggling because of some of the core teachings that my parents bought into.
A few years ago I moved out on my own (at the time it was to a TC, it help to start the separation) and have not regretted it since. Even though I am struggling a little with money I was able to at least start school. Many of the problems I noticed in my family growing up were not caused by ATI/IBLP but were considerably enhanced because of it. As for my siblings some of them have been able to move on and do well despite how we were raised and some of them are still at home and continue to struggle.
I would like to say thank you to all of the writers on this site that have been willing to share their own experiences, it has helped me to see a lot more of what has gone on in ATI than I thought.
Thank you, J. J.
Wow, someone posted a major hurt in their life & you had the nerve to post complete disregard for them as a person? I sure hope that you don't think of yourself as a super spiritual person.
I don't know if you were ever at the ITC during that time period, but I was and I saw every bit of what was written happening to the children (yes under 18 is a child) while I was there.
Wow. Have some compassion for the young woman who shared her horrific story before you go telling her to stop whinning.
Thanks for your courage in sharing your story. My family was in ATI for a while and I also had lots of emotional rebuilding to do...but by God's grace he has healed me. It wasn't good, but God has used my hardships to make me a more compassionate person towards others. I'm looking towards counseling in the future now! (which would have never happened if I wouldn't have gone through so many hardships). Thanks again, and may God continue to heal you by His grace!
Daniel, what an awesome story! Seems like a number of former ATI students have gone into counseling (seems to me there are also some clusters of computer folks and lawyer folks). I think perhaps that is part of how God is redeeming our stories - by helping us help others, sort of like 2 Cor 1:4. Blessings!
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We were a 2nd year family. I had a full beard when we first started and had to shave to leave just a cookie duster. We followed a lot of the teachings and went to Knoxville each year. We also took a lot of things at arms length. Trying to keep the intent without the letter of it all.
I cry when I hear of what this person went through. Our children did go to the ITC for a short time and while there were good things to learn there, they also saw the odd things happening as well. Our son and daughter were there at the same time and they had a meal together each day. That raised some eye brows at first, but when challenged, they knew enough to stand alone and say they were under their parents instruction to have that time together to support each other.
My prayers are with each of the people who have been involved.
Henry
My first reaction was, "They took away your medication, that is so dangerous!" My friend who introduced me to IBLP seminars' older sister was on medication, and I have known, it seems for the longest time, that this is a medically dangerous thing to do. (I picture a "nurse Ratchett" doing this to you.) I was not a part of the IBLP ministry, but was close to it because of friends' involvement. I confess, I loved to go to IBYC seminars at Arie Crown and then UICC Pavilion and was impressed with the clapping and people being congratulated and stories of "reverse babies"' etc. My close friend told me she wanted to use IBLP/ATI books to home school her children, so I watched from a sideline and observed. I babysat her children and when I got married, they were in my wedding, so they were very precious to me. I live near Oak Brook and am in church with many IBLP families and alumni. I hope that we are able to present Christianity as "one fellowship of LOVE, throughout the whole wide earth." That is our common goal, and I pray for healing for all who were hurt, there seem to be many, and I am so sorry.
I am absolutely appauled by these stories. I also was an LIT at ITC. I was sent through the juvenile court system. I had a disruptive past and did not wish to attend school. I had a boyfriend that was 7 years my elder and I was constantly disrespectful to my parents. Upon my arrival I was greeted and very warmly accepted by every person that I met. I was never looked at like an outcast... even though my hair was two different colors and my jeans were 3 sizes to big. I was never forced into anything I did not want to do and I made real friends. I had chores just the same as anyone else (including staff and leaders). I was encouraged to keep a journal. I got to call home everyday after supper. We had regular outings. Shopping trips. Trips to the zoo, Turkey Run for canoe/swimming trips. Trips to the Children's Museum. I learned trades at ITC. Mostly I learned respect and the love of the Lord. I am now almost 30 years old and ITC still holds a very very special place in my heart. It truly hurts my feelings to know that there are such foul stories being told about these wonderful people with the vest intentions of teaching young people how to become proper, respectful adults. At no time (Prayer Room included) was I ever treated unkindly.
That's awesome, Frani! Thank you for sharing. I for one certainly hope that the good stories outnumber the bad, though we may never know. I have to imagine that the positive changes you continue to experience are a blessing not only to you but to those who invested in you.
Frani,
Thanks for sharing your story! It really touched and encouraged me. When I read your name, a picture of a teen-age girl came to my mind...I think I remember meeting you at the ITC. I know for me and many of my friends who worked as leaders at the ITC or other training centers our hearts' desire was to help and love the youth we were working with. It was devastating as I realized that in so many cases we did just the opposite. Your story is a beautiful one that shows how God can use us even when we go about things the wrong way or ignorantly. One of my greatest regrets is thinking about a young girl we tried to "help" who had depression. We knew absolutely nothing about the psychological and emotional struggles she was facing or how to help her and ended up pushing her further and further into her depression.
Yet, in the midst of stories of pain and abuse, there are still some stories like you of people whose lives were touched for good at the training centers. To me, this is a picture of the beauty of God's grace - taking our mistakes and our wrongs and still bringing something good out of it. Thank you for sharing! So glad to hear you have good memories of the ITC and that you graduated from high school and attended college! Yay! Way to go!
I realize Frani it's been over a year since you wrote this, but I just had to leave a comment and thank you for sharing your experience. After spending almost a year trying to be the best leader I could be to the various girls I was assigned to, the hours I spent trying to connect with them and help them recover from their past and find hope in God, it means so much to hear a positive response. Us leaders were SO young—we meant well and just wanted to serve God. Bless you for your encouraging story.
Even with a sad heart from this I stand by ITC wholeheartedly and say thank you for helping me change my life for the better! I now have the best relationship with my parents. I have gone on to enjoy school. I graduated High School and attended college. I am married and happy. I still to this day keep in touch with people from ITC. To God be all the glory!!!
Fran, it really is awesome and wonderful that you had such an awesome experience. Frankly I am surprised to hear of such a pleasant circumstance, I've heard so many horrible stories.. I do ask that you please do not discount the horror stories as invalid or untrue, simply because they are not your experience.
sadly it doesn't just happen at the centers I lived with a family and observed the abuse first hand although they tried to hide it
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I am sorry but I know from experience that your information about the indiapolis institute is not accurate because I also was an lit at that same institue and I was sent home because I was rebellious. I do agree that some of what they do, I don't agree with, but they aren't what you say they are.
I was also on my best behavior to begin with and was allowed to come out of my suit after a week but I was also very rebellious after that and ended up in the prayer room. Yes they put handcuffs on me and tied me down but I remember I was a danger to myself and others which is why they had to restrain me. Yes that was wrong of them to do. And yes I was in the prayer room for days at a time. They bring you three meals a day, not two. On Sunday they brought two cause they ate brunch and then dinner but the other days you had three meals. I also suffered from what you suffered from and I did not leave the place feeling what you claim to felt.
This is what I remember other then being in the prayer room and getting spankings... I was allowed to do a lot. Yes we did chores, but my kids also do chores at home, because you have to teach them about real life and chores are real life. Yes we got up early but who doesn't in the real world who actually has a job or going to school and taking care of children?! I remember going on treasure hunts, learning different things that would make me successful in the real world once I was old enough to be out on my own. I was into munto music and writing, and they let me do that. I had journals and guess what? They never took them away from me. I had poetry books and I kept those too. We would go outside and I would run around the parking lot with one of my leaders for miles because it released stress. We played games and sung songs. I was in the choir and the children's choir, I learned the harp, and I met mayors all over the world. I even talked to bill gothard and he even took me on some of his trips. I remember cleaning up the new bulding they just bought right before I arrived. And I remember my leaders not being what you are saying about leaders. They were there to help, and they were barely adults. They did so much for me and even the gergeni's.
Also when I was in the prayer room. I not only saw my leaders but I also saw the gergeni's. I would ask mrs. Gergeni for things and she would bring them to me. She brought me yarn for me to make a blanket. She also brought me a tape player which tapes of bibe stories I could listen to. She would talk to me for hours at a time trying to get through to me but I was so damaged from my past that I couldn't let her in or anyone else for that matter.
I also remember getting together with other lit's and their leaders and having slumbar parties and we talked. I have pictures of it. We weren't able to talk to them when we first got there but after the first two weeks in the suit (I stayed for two months in the suit, but after a week I was able to come out) they usually move you to a regular room and then you were able to communicate with other lit's and their leaders. We ate meals together, we worked together and we socialized together.
We were not confined and ordered around like you said. Yes we had to wear skirts or dresses because that was the dress code, everybody wore them, not just us. Yes we couldn't listen to the worldly music because that was also their rules. I wasn't allowed to listen to comtemporary music. Was I upset? Yes. Did it ruin me? No. When you have rules, you have to abide by those rules, and there is nothing wrong with that. You brought up makeup. I wasn't allowed to wear makeup for the first week, but after that they let me. I was 13 years old when I was there and wearing it. My leaders took me to walmart and with my weekly allance helped me pick it out. I also had a makeover while still there, and their trainees at the time who was taking up cosmetology gave me the makeover for my 14th birthday.
We were sent there to learn basic principles of life the Godly way because we were troubled. But like me, some rebel and refuse to obey authority. I was a hard case to crack and they tried everything. I didn't change until I had my first child at 22, and then the way I saw life changed. I wanted the best for my child and I saw where my life was headed and it wasn't good...
Yes the people at the indianapolis institute made mistakes like everybody does, noone is perfect, but they aren't some horrible monsters stripping you of everything. They were there to help and they truely cared about those in their care. I didn't see it until I had my own child and I finally for the first time felt what unconditional love was, and I would do anything to make sure my children did not have the life I had to endure. I didn't even become a christian until two years ago when I was pregnant with my last baby. And I saw that the institute was trying to do long before that.
Maybe you need to reevaluate yourself and see that maybe you are not being completely honest and you are holding some resentment for lies that didn't even occure...
Also at the institute, I was given rewards for showing good behavior. I was allowed to get frosty's, I was allowed to go to the zoo, fun parks and had a lot of other things for my good behavior. I also went on trips and even went home with one of my leaders. I ruined that trip, not them, but me by my own behaviors. I also went to florida with another leader, and we taught kids. I felt so important because I was 13 and called miss tracy. I also ruined that trip. I was able to go home for christmas. Mr. Gergeni's son's family took me. At the time, they just had their first baby. My parents lived in georgia and they drove me there and back. They did a lot for me. Did they make mistakes? Yes! But are they horrible people? No... they did what they thought was best, and they tried to instill in me the principles I really needed in my life but I rebelled.
What you are saying about the indianapolis institute is incorrect. If I came on here not ever being in that building and being a lit myself, I would think that institute was a cult and needed to be shut down by what you wrote, but since I know better because I was there myself then I know that is not the case. You are probably bitter and making up lies and excuses for your behavior, and pointing blame at the wrong party. Maybe you should sit back and realize where the blame needs to go, and do a lot of praying because God will never point you in the wrong direction... I hope you find peace and truth:-)
Just because different people have different experiences at the same place does not mean that someone is lying. It's nice that you didn't experience as much abuse as others did, but that doesn't invalidate their experience and it's very unloving to say it does.
I really appreciated reading your story, Tracy. Thanks for sharing!
It's so good to hear about those that experienced benefit, perhaps even years down the road. May God bless the good efforts of folks there for more stories like this.
It seems to me that it's easy for us to project our experience on to everyone else. If something was terrible for me, I might assume it was terrible for everyone, for example. You look back at being handcuffed but realize it might have been the best thing, whereas someone else who was handcuffed when it truly was not the best thing might see it differently. With the journal, if someone else's journal was taken away, it would not be OK for them to assume you are lying when you say yours wasn't. And the other way around, you were allowed to keep yours, but that doesn't mean that everyone else was allowed to keep theirs. But both of your stories are your own experiences, and both are completely valid.
It sounds like you had a rough beginning but have made some good changes and that your child has a good mother. People want to see miracles but I think it's one of the most beautiful miracles when God changes a life. God bless you as you raise your precious child!
Tracy,
So good to hear your story! I think I was at the ITC at the same time as you. Do you remember going roller-blading when you were at the ITC? Love to hear how God has worked in your life through your children and how you became a Christian!
One thing I saw at the ITC and in the Log Cabin Program was that some LITs were treated completely different depending on who their leaders were. Some leaders really loved, prayed for, and poured their lives out for there LITs. Other leaders were struggling themselves with depression, anger, pride, or were just at the training center because they themselves were sent there by their parents or Mr. G.. Other leaders were completely overwhelmed and over-reacted to anything their LIT might do. A lot of responsibility was given to the leaders and for many of us it was more than we could handle. Unfortunately some of the leaders abused the authority and responsibilities that they were given. Sometimes the stories that went back to the Gergeni's about some of the LITs or leaders were very much one-sided and misconstrued, the perspective of one person who didn't like another rather than the actual truth.
I'm so glad the leaders you had really loved and cared for you and did their best to speak God's love into your life. There were some really good leaders through the years at the ITC and Log Cabin programs who wept for, prayed for, and did their best to love and train the LITs under their care.
So thrilled to hear God's story of how He worked in your life!
"I also suffered from what you suffered from and I did not leave the place feeling what you claim to felt."
I'm very sorry for what both of you have endured at the hands of this organization, although you each had slightly different experiences. I will just say, that each person's experiences and emotions are their own; no one else can tell you what you feel.
Also, it's pretty incriminating that they spanked you, if this is true (and Tracy, I believe your story). This is clearly illegal.
hi tracy! I was an LIT at the same time as you, in Indianapolis, and I remember you well. I am glad to see that you have found peace through your own family. I was also amazed to read the maturity you have since possessed and the way you are able to reflect on the usefulness of your time there.
As others have said I do believe your experience as an LIT varied depending on who your leader was. This is definitely true. One of my leaders was infamous in her regime and while I respected her, I feared her deeply. She would wake me up in the middle of the night to memorize hymns for no reason. I was not allowed to talk. I felt demoralized.
It also was very dependent on your support system and your family back home, and this is where I had the most trouble, as I used like a pawn in the middle of an increasingly abusive family situation and the Gergeni's, who were convinced that I could heal them through my own Christian transformation (they are Catholic). Those were truly my darkest days. I would come back from home visits with wounds from the attacks and I would be sent to the prayer room so that I could reflect on why my behavior made my parents treat me that way and how I could get them to convert. On the upside, as a result of the abuse at home during visits I was never, ever spanked. Just locked in a room for four days to memorize Romans because my mother put out a lit cigarette on my back. So if I wasn't traumatized before going there, I was after! I only got to leave when I did because my parents realized too late that the Gergeni's were no longer on their "side" and pulled me out overnight and moved me 2 states away. Their rights were terminated by the court barely two years later.
I cannot look back on my experiences there fondly, though I do certainly miss some of the people I grew close to in the year and a half I was there and hope that they are doing well. I did receive an excellent musical education through Sound Foundations and learned to play piano and violin, which gave me purpose and a release. I finished all of the home schooling material they had in that year, what would have been my 9th grade, and that gave me a great sense of accomplishment and pride.
I still struggle to come to terms with that lost period of my life because I am still shocked that it ever happened in the first place. I am without a doubt convinced to my bones that IBLP is a cult, and that the ITC was that orchestration at the worst.
Tracy,
I just looked back up at the top and noticed that the original poster was at the ITC 2003-2004. If I remember right, you were at the ITC around 97-99, is that correct?
I distinctly remember visiting the ITC a couple times around 2003-2004 and I was shocked and saddened by the spirit of depression that I sensed at the ITC among so many of the leaders and LITs. The rules and atmosphere at the ITC was not always the same and changed each year as the leaders changed. I think perhaps the way things were in 2003 - 2004 were much different at the ITC from when you were there.
Blessings and love to you, Tracy.
Hope, thank you for your enlightening and kind response! I hope Tracy sees it and has a better understanding of the situation.
Yes Hope I was there around that time you were talking about and I also remember rollerblading:-)
I do have a lot of good memories there as well as a lot of sad memories. I was also gone during the years of 2003 and 2004.
I know the gergeni's. I was very close to them as well as bill gothard, mary gergeni and a lot of other people there. I know they loved the children in their care and they would not have hurt them or abused them. They were trying to help the lit's. I don't know about the leaders but I do know about the gergeni's and bill gothard and they would never hurt anyone.
And yes I was spanked as an lit and that was not incriminating. My parents gave the gergeni's permision to spank me and I do appreciate what they did for me.
Tracy, just a thought, it's a bad idea to put your trust in humans. "so n so would never hurt anyone." wellll.... you never know what a person's heart really is, need to be careful saying things like that. Most sociopaths were not found out until they did something horrible. (not calling anyone a sociopath persay, just making a point.)
Thank you for being brave enough to tell your story....and I'm sorry for all you went through. Truly sorry.
To the other "Ex-LITs" Traci and Frani, thank your stars that this was not your journey, still be grateful for your time there....but dont make the mistake of thinking that your experience was the ONLY experience. We all have our own stories... Lets support healing and finding our voice through telling our stories.
Reading through this, my heart goes out to you all... Angeline, Tracy, Christina... I think I know you and remember you all. Thank you for sharing your story with us. I do pray for healing for the wounds and devastation that was left behind. Love to you all.